Please show off what crt shaders can do!

Nesguy · 28 October 2020 13:49

No thanks; I want my games to look good. Halation is really awful.

It’s definitely not sharper than an average CRT TV. What is your basis for comparison/what are you going for? I’m trying to emulate an average TV that has component or RGB inputs, or an average arcade monitor. None of this composhit over the top exaggerated vapor wave stuff, that’s not my thing.

jelbo · 28 October 2020 14:07

I understand you. Back in the day I was using RGB SCART where possible. But with emulating CRT’s, I always like to see some more imperfections. A bit of moving noise, some blurriness (I like your bicubic interpolation), some glow. Not as much as sonkun’s screenshots though. I don’t really have a reference other than my memories of various CRT TV’s I’ve used.

lilbud · 28 October 2020 15:39

I think I’m at a pretty good place with this shader as is, What do you think?

Nesguy · 28 October 2020 16:31

Glow always winds up looking extremely artificial to me, I’ve never seen glow that didn’t look very fake and distracting, especially at 1080p or less. Glow halos IRL do not follow geometrically perfect lines like they do in shaders, and glow washes out the colors in a really bad way.

Noise/grain - IDK where this is coming from, is this actually a CRT thing? I’ve never noticed anything like it on any of the several CRTs I’ve owned, I would guess that it’s a symptom of a dying monitor. I know film grain is a thing, but that’s not related to CRTs per se.

There are so many different ways to emulate a CRT, the bicubic stuff is a bit of an artistic interpretation and might look more like a photo of a CRT or a CRT at normal viewing distance; up close it falls apart. To have a fully convincing CRT emulation we need retina resolution displays where you need a microscope to see the pixels, and we need absurd brightness and contrast levels (1000+ nits) to do everything while adding black frame insertion (essential to preserve mask detail during scrolling).

Anyway, BBB is posting 4K screenshots where he’s got 4x the number of pixels to work with. That’s a whole different ballgame compared to shaders at 1080p.

Nesguy · 28 October 2020 17:24

Kinda hard to judge from that one example but it seems a bit dark to me. Could use more pop IMO.

I would also consider adding a mask; mask 1 or 2 works well at that resolution. If you’re going for that BVM/31kHz look, you should skip the mask and probably just increase the vertical sharpness a bit.

Nesguy · 28 October 2020 19:22

@jelbo

There’s a useful sharpness test in Fudoh’s Test Suite. The black circle should appear as solid black at normal viewing distance. The first circle looks more or less solid with just a slight amount of ghosting on the sides. The second is definitely too blurry.

horizontal sharpness 4.50

horizontal sharpness 2.00

lilbud · 28 October 2020 20:21

I can get more examples up later. It’s dark in the screenshot but fairly bright on my monitor.

lilbud · 28 October 2020 23:06

Wild Arms appears to be a very dark game altogether, the shader looks a little better on a bright game like F-Zero. I might need to dial it in a bit

Yoshi’s Island

Nesguy · 29 October 2020 02:42

I think maybe it’s a bit too warm, and the horizontal sharpness should come down a bit. Of course everything ultimately comes down to preference.

Post settings and I’ll run it through the Test Suite to see what can be improved.

lilbud · 29 October 2020 02:02

shaders = "10"
shader0 = "shaders_slang/stock.slang"
filter_linear0 = "false"
wrap_mode0 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input0 = "false"
alias0 = ""
float_framebuffer0 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer0 = "false"
scale_type_x0 = "source"
scale_x0 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y0 = "source"
scale_y0 = "1.000000"
shader1 = "shaders_slang/stock.slang"
filter_linear1 = "true"
wrap_mode1 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input1 = "false"
alias1 = ""
float_framebuffer1 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer1 = "false"
scale_type_x1 = "source"
scale_x1 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y1 = "source"
scale_y1 = "1.000000"
shader2 = "shaders_slang/misc/grade.slang"
filter_linear2 = "true"
wrap_mode2 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input2 = "false"
alias2 = "WhitePointPass"
float_framebuffer2 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer2 = "false"
scale_type_x2 = "source"
scale_x2 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y2 = "source"
scale_y2 = "1.000000"
shader3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/crtsim/composite.slang"
filter_linear3 = "true"
wrap_mode3 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input3 = "false"
alias3 = "AfterglowPass"
float_framebuffer3 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer3 = "false"
scale_type_x3 = "source"
scale_x3 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y3 = "source"
scale_y3 = "1.000000"
shader4 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/avg-lum.slang"
filter_linear4 = "true"
wrap_mode4 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input4 = "true"
alias4 = "AvgLumPass"
float_framebuffer4 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer4 = "false"
scale_type_x4 = "source"
scale_x4 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y4 = "source"
scale_y4 = "1.000000"
shader5 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize.slang"
filter_linear5 = "true"
wrap_mode5 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input5 = "false"
alias5 = "LinearizePass"
float_framebuffer5 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer5 = "false"
scale_type_x5 = "source"
scale_x5 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y5 = "source"
scale_y5 = "1.000000"
shader6 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_horiz.slang"
filter_linear6 = "true"
wrap_mode6 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input6 = "false"
alias6 = ""
float_framebuffer6 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer6 = "false"
scale_type_x6 = "source"
scale_x6 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y6 = "source"
scale_y6 = "1.000000"
shader7 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_vert.slang"
filter_linear7 = "true"
wrap_mode7 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input7 = "false"
alias7 = "GlowPass"
float_framebuffer7 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer7 = "false"
scale_type_x7 = "source"
scale_x7 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y7 = "source"
scale_y7 = "1.000000"
shader8 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize_scanlines.slang"
filter_linear8 = "true"
wrap_mode8 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input8 = "false"
alias8 = ""
float_framebuffer8 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer8 = "false"
scale_type_x8 = "source"
scale_x8 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y8 = "source"
scale_y8 = "1.000000"
shader9 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/crt-guest-dr-venom.slang"
filter_linear9 = "true"
wrap_mode9 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input9 = "false"
alias9 = ""
float_framebuffer9 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer9 = "false"
scale_type_x9 = "viewport"
scale_x9 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y9 = "viewport"
scale_y9 = "1.000000"
parameters = "g_gamma_in;g_signal_type;g_gamma_type;g_crtgamut;g_space_out;g_hue_degrees;g_I_SHIFT;g_Q_SHIFT;g_I_MUL;g_Q_MUL;g_lum_fix;g_vignette;g_vstr;g_vpower;g_lum;g_cntrst;g_mid;wp_temperature;g_sat;g_vibr;g_satr;g_satg;g_satb;g_lift;blr;blg;blb;wlr;wlg;wlb;rg;rb;gr;gb;br;bg;LUT_Size1;LUT1_toggle;LUT_Size2;LUT2_toggle;Tuning_Sharp;Tuning_Persistence_R;Tuning_Persistence_G;Tuning_Persistence_B;Tuning_Bleed;Tuning_Artifacts;NTSCLerp;NTSCArtifactScale;animate_artifacts;lsmooth;GAMMA_INPUT;TAPSH;GLOW_FALLOFF_H;TAPSV;GLOW_FALLOFF_V;TATE;IOS;OS;BLOOM;brightboost;brightboost1;gsl;scanline1;scanline2;beam_min;beam_max;beam_size;h_sharp;s_sharp;csize;bsize;warpX;warpY;glow;shadowMask;masksize;vertmask;slotmask;slotwidth;double_slot;slotms;mcut;maskDark;maskLight;CGWG;gamma_out;spike;inter;interm;bloom;scans"
g_gamma_in = "2.600000"
g_signal_type = "0.000000"
g_gamma_type = "0.000000"
g_crtgamut = "1.000000"
g_space_out = "0.000000"
g_hue_degrees = "0.000000"
g_I_SHIFT = "0.000000"
g_Q_SHIFT = "0.000000"
g_I_MUL = "1.000000"
g_Q_MUL = "1.000000"
g_lum_fix = "0.000000"
g_vignette = "0.000000"
g_vstr = "40.000000"
g_vpower = "0.200000"
g_lum = "0.000000"
g_cntrst = "0.000000"
g_mid = "1.000000"
wp_temperature = "6504.000000"
g_sat = "0.000000"
g_vibr = "0.000000"
g_satr = "0.000000"
g_satg = "0.000000"
g_satb = "0.000000"
g_lift = "0.000000"
blr = "0.000000"
blg = "0.000000"
blb = "0.000000"
wlr = "1.000000"
wlg = "1.000000"
wlb = "1.000000"
rg = "0.000000"
rb = "0.000000"
gr = "0.000000"
gb = "0.000000"
br = "0.000000"
bg = "0.000000"
LUT_Size1 = "32.000000"
LUT1_toggle = "0.000000"
LUT_Size2 = "32.000000"
LUT2_toggle = "0.000000"
Tuning_Sharp = "0.000000"
Tuning_Persistence_R = "0.000000"
Tuning_Persistence_G = "0.000000"
Tuning_Persistence_B = "0.000000"
Tuning_Bleed = "0.000000"
Tuning_Artifacts = "0.000000"
NTSCLerp = "0.000000"
NTSCArtifactScale = "0.000000"
animate_artifacts = "0.000000"
lsmooth = "0.900000"
GAMMA_INPUT = "2.400000"
TAPSH = "1.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_H = "0.000000"
TAPSV = "1.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_V = "0.000000"
TATE = "0.000000"
IOS = "0.000000"
OS = "1.000000"
BLOOM = "0.000000"
brightboost = "1.000000"
brightboost1 = "1.000000"
gsl = "2.000000"
scanline1 = "15.000000"
scanline2 = "5.000000"
beam_min = "1.300000"
beam_max = "0.700000"
beam_size = "0.000000"
h_sharp = "6.000000"
s_sharp = "0.400000"
csize = "0.000000"
bsize = "575.000000"
warpX = "0.000000"
warpY = "0.000000"
glow = "0.020000"
shadowMask = "-1.000000"
masksize = "1.000000"
vertmask = "-0.000000"
slotmask = "0.000000"
slotwidth = "2.000000"
double_slot = "1.000000"
slotms = "2.000000"
mcut = "0.250000"
maskDark = "0.200000"
maskLight = "1.500000"
CGWG = "1.000000"
gamma_out = "2.400000"
spike = "1.000000"
inter = "400.000000"
interm = "3.000000"
bloom = "0.000000"
scans = "1.000000"
textures = "MaskTexture;NTSCArtifactSampler;shadowMaskSampler;SamplerLUT1;SamplerLUT2;SamplerLUT3"
MaskTexture = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/mame_hlsl/resources/aperture-grille.png"
MaskTexture_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
MaskTexture_mipmap = "false"
NTSCArtifactSampler = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/crtsim/artifacts.png"
NTSCArtifactSampler_linear = "true"
NTSCArtifactSampler_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
NTSCArtifactSampler_mipmap = "false"
shadowMaskSampler = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/crtsim/mask.png"
shadowMaskSampler_linear = "true"
shadowMaskSampler_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
shadowMaskSampler_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT1 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron1.png"
SamplerLUT1_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT1_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT1_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT2 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron2.png"
SamplerLUT2_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT2_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT2_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/other1.png"
SamplerLUT3_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT3_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT3_mipmap = "false"

Nesguy · 29 October 2020 03:05

@lilbud I’ll take a closer look either tonight or tomorrow sometime. In the meantime check out my recent settings (previous post), I think it’s close to what you’re going for. The deconvergence is an easy on/off toggle; just set “reflection toggle.” I think it makes for a more vibrant image, though.

sonkun · 29 October 2020 04:19

Get on your pc and post some shots up, you’re the reason I even started using deconvergence in my shaders now lol

Syh · 29 October 2020 04:43

It’ll have to be tomorrow, as I’m not home atm.

Tomorrow or Friday I’ll get on there and take some screenshots.

sonkun · 29 October 2020 04:47

Nice. I’ll be around.

Nesguy · 29 October 2020 06:19

Played with bright boost, was able to improve the dynamic range. This might be a bit too bloomy; if so, lower bright boost bright pixels to 4.00 or so.

shaders = "9"
shader0 = "shaders_slang/misc/grade.slang"
filter_linear0 = "true"
wrap_mode0 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input0 = "false"
alias0 = "WhitePointPass"
float_framebuffer0 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer0 = "false"
scale_type_x0 = "source"
scale_x0 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y0 = "source"
scale_y0 = "1.000000"
shader1 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/afterglow.slang"
filter_linear1 = "true"
wrap_mode1 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input1 = "false"
alias1 = "AfterglowPass"
float_framebuffer1 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer1 = "false"
scale_type_x1 = "source"
scale_x1 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y1 = "source"
scale_y1 = "1.000000"
shader2 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/avg-lum.slang"
filter_linear2 = "true"
wrap_mode2 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input2 = "true"
alias2 = "AvgLumPass"
float_framebuffer2 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer2 = "false"
scale_type_x2 = "source"
scale_x2 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y2 = "source"
scale_y2 = "1.000000"
shader3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize.slang"
filter_linear3 = "true"
wrap_mode3 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input3 = "false"
alias3 = "LinearizePass"
float_framebuffer3 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer3 = "false"
scale_type_x3 = "source"
scale_x3 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y3 = "source"
scale_y3 = "1.000000"
shader4 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_horiz.slang"
filter_linear4 = "true"
wrap_mode4 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input4 = "false"
alias4 = ""
float_framebuffer4 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer4 = "false"
scale_type_x4 = "source"
scale_x4 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y4 = "source"
scale_y4 = "1.000000"
shader5 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_vert.slang"
filter_linear5 = "true"
wrap_mode5 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input5 = "false"
alias5 = "GlowPass"
float_framebuffer5 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer5 = "false"
scale_type_x5 = "source"
scale_x5 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y5 = "source"
scale_y5 = "1.000000"
shader6 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize_scanlines.slang"
filter_linear6 = "true"
wrap_mode6 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input6 = "false"
alias6 = ""
float_framebuffer6 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer6 = "false"
scale_type_x6 = "source"
scale_x6 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y6 = "source"
scale_y6 = "1.000000"
shader7 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/crt-guest-dr-venom.slang"
filter_linear7 = "true"
wrap_mode7 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input7 = "false"
alias7 = ""
float_framebuffer7 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer7 = "false"
scale_type_x7 = "viewport"
scale_x7 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y7 = "viewport"
scale_y7 = "1.000000"
shader8 = "shaders_slang/misc/glass.slang"
wrap_mode8 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input8 = "false"
alias8 = ""
float_framebuffer8 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer8 = "false"
parameters = "g_gamma_in;g_signal_type;g_gamma_type;g_crtgamut;g_space_out;g_hue_degrees;g_I_SHIFT;g_Q_SHIFT;g_I_MUL;g_Q_MUL;g_lum_fix;g_vignette;g_vstr;g_vpower;g_lum;g_cntrst;g_mid;wp_temperature;g_sat;g_vibr;g_satr;g_satg;g_satb;g_lift;blr;blg;blb;wlr;wlg;wlb;rg;rb;gr;gb;br;bg;LUT_Size1;LUT1_toggle;LUT_Size2;LUT2_toggle;SW;AR;PR;AG;PG;AB;PB;sat;lsmooth;GAMMA_INPUT;TAPSH;GLOW_FALLOFF_H;TAPSV;GLOW_FALLOFF_V;TATE;IOS;OS;BLOOM;brightboost;brightboost1;gsl;scanline1;scanline2;beam_min;beam_max;beam_size;h_sharp;s_sharp;csize;bsize;warpX;warpY;glow;shadowMask;masksize;vertmask;slotmask;slotwidth;double_slot;slotms;mcut;maskDark;maskLight;CGWG;gamma_out;spike;inter;interm;bloom;scans;g_csize;g_bsize;g_flicker;g_shaker;g_refltog;g_reflgrain;g_reflstr;g_fresnel;g_reflblur;gz;gx;gy;gzr;gzg;gzb;goxr;goyr;goxg;goyg;goxb;goyb;TO;PH;PER;ASAT;temperature;luma_preserve;wp_red;wp_green;wp_blue"
g_gamma_in = "2.500000"
g_signal_type = "0.000000"
g_gamma_type = "1.000000"
g_crtgamut = "2.000000"
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g_Q_SHIFT = "0.000000"
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g_vstr = "40.000000"
g_vpower = "0.200000"
g_lum = "0.000000"
g_cntrst = "0.000000"
g_mid = "0.500000"
wp_temperature = "8004.000000"
g_sat = "0.000000"
g_vibr = "0.000000"
g_satr = "0.000000"
g_satg = "0.000000"
g_satb = "0.000000"
g_lift = "0.000000"
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blg = "0.000000"
blb = "0.000000"
wlr = "1.000000"
wlg = "1.000000"
wlb = "1.000000"
rg = "0.000000"
rb = "0.000000"
gr = "0.000000"
gb = "0.000000"
br = "0.000000"
bg = "0.000000"
LUT_Size1 = "16.000000"
LUT1_toggle = "0.000000"
LUT_Size2 = "64.000000"
LUT2_toggle = "0.000000"
SW = "1.000000"
AR = "0.070000"
PR = "0.050000"
AG = "0.070000"
PG = "0.050000"
AB = "0.070000"
PB = "0.050000"
sat = "0.100000"
lsmooth = "0.900000"
GAMMA_INPUT = "3.499999"
TAPSH = "4.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_H = "0.300000"
TAPSV = "4.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_V = "0.300000"
TATE = "0.000000"
IOS = "0.000000"
OS = "1.000000"
BLOOM = "0.000000"
brightboost = "1.000003"
brightboost1 = "4.500001"
gsl = "0.000000"
scanline1 = "1.000000"
scanline2 = "23.000000"
beam_min = "2.500000"
beam_max = "1.000000"
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bsize = "600.000000"
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warpY = "0.000000"
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vertmask = "0.000000"
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slotwidth = "2.000000"
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slotms = "1.000000"
mcut = "0.250000"
maskDark = "0.500000"
maskLight = "1.500000"
CGWG = "0.000000"
gamma_out = "3.499999"
spike = "1.000000"
inter = "400.000000"
interm = "1.000000"
bloom = "0.000000"
scans = "0.500000"
g_csize = "0.000000"
g_bsize = "2000.000000"
g_flicker = "0.000000"
g_shaker = "0.000000"
g_refltog = "1.000000"
g_reflgrain = "0.000000"
g_reflstr = "0.000000"
g_fresnel = "0.000000"
g_reflblur = "0.000000"
gz = "1.000000"
gx = "1.000000"
gy = "1.000000"
gzr = "1.000000"
gzg = "1.000000"
gzb = "1.000000"
goxr = "0.020000"
goyr = "0.000000"
goxg = "0.000000"
goyg = "0.020000"
goxb = "0.000000"
goyb = "0.000000"
TO = "0.000000"
PH = "2.000000"
PER = "0.750000"
ASAT = "0.200000"
temperature = "6500.000000"
luma_preserve = "1.000000"
wp_red = "-0.000001"
wp_green = "-0.000001"
wp_blue = "-0.000001"
textures = "SamplerLUT1;SamplerLUT2;SamplerLUT3"
SamplerLUT1 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron1.png"
SamplerLUT1_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT1_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT1_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT2 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron2.png"
SamplerLUT2_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT2_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT2_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/other1.png"
SamplerLUT3_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT3_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT3_mipmap = "false"

lilbud · 29 October 2020 15:15

Just tried this shader and it is very garish and blown out, not sure if it’s my monitor or what, but at times the light colors are way too much.

Nesguy · 29 October 2020 19:24

I can almost guarantee that the problem is your monitor; both of the shots you just posted look absolutely fine (bloomy, though). Is your monitor calibrated?

You should use the same aspect ratio that I’m using in my shots, different scales will affect the appearance of scanlines, masks, etc.

If anything is too bright there will be clipping in color bars or grey scale, both of which look fine. Blue gets clipped a bit because of the color temp (~8000K). EDIT: Actually, with these current settings I find that the rule “increase brightness until you get clipping” no longer applies; it’s possible to increase brightness to the point where the colors wash out without getting clipping when using these settings. So instead it’s best to just check a variety of sources when adjusting bright pixel boost to ensure that nothing is getting washed out too much. Dark pixel boost should be left at 1.00, resulting in a no-op.

A setting of 4.00 or so for bright pixels is probably more reasonable; some colors will start to look washed out if you increase this too much. 4.50 is admittedly pretty bloomy, looks okay with some games I guess.

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lilbud · 29 October 2020 19:48

I calibrated my monitor and tried the shader again. The top of the screen in F-Zero is still way too washed out and bright. To the point where the timer blends into the sky.

The screenshots look fine, but actually playing a game with the shader is too bright.

I tried to take some pictures, first is the one you just posted. Second is the one I posted, but with white point lowered to 6000

2 new photos by Lilbud

hunterk · 29 October 2020 20:04

That XMvSF shot looks a lot like my Neotec arcade monitor (excuse potato camera). Good stuff.

Nesguy · 29 October 2020 20:22

That second shot is too yellow, what color temp is your display set to? Contrast might also be set too high on the display. Is the display calibrated to sRGB?

Nothing’s getting clipped and all the colors look well-saturated in these shots, as seen on my display.