Crt-Royale Kurozumi Edition Help

RetroArch Additions Shaders
#21

Did you try turning on Integer Scaling?

#22

yah, of course I mean with integer scaling on

#23

Does it show up in screenshots? If not, can you provide instructions to reproduce the issue?

#24

[QUOTE=fogueman;38688]Hi guys… i´ve been following the whole crt shader thing for a while now. Crt Royale Kurozumi looks really stunning. I think you guys should write some kind of guide about crt shading, covering the hot topics just to explain to newcomers… some of them just don´t know what they´re missing.

The only complain I have for this shader is that I seem to have some sort of problem as soon as vertical scrolling is implied. Like moire effect (don´t know exactly how to call it, just something is wrong with the scanlines, like they become more visible and some of them appear to be irregular).

I´m pretty much sure that you have the solution for this. I´ve tweaked some of the settings (for instance, I prefer much lower gamma) and it seems to reduce the issue but it won´t go completely away. On the other hand, crt hyllian (another awesome shader) doesn´t seem to suffer from this, at least here.[/QUOTE]

Are you using geometry? If so, especially with cubic sharpening applied, you’ll get those moiré patterns when scrolling. Easiest way to fix is to turn off the geometry.

#25

Nice i tried these settings with "crt-royale-fake-bloom-intel.cgp’. My laptop couldnot handle the other CRT-Royale presets full speed except that one. It is a cool shader even though not so good on my 768p screen i imagine would be better in 1080p. I personally like CRT-hyllian-glow the most, this one is great too.

a screenshot how it looks in 768p. Not bad at all

#26

Hi guys, first off thanks for your responses. If by geometry you mean curvature… no im not using it. I´ve running some playtests with vertically scrolling games. It´s more noticeable with bright backgrounds and definitely not a case of scaline misalignment. It is more a case of the scanlines being like present or moving during vertical scrolling. I really think that the term is moiree effect. It doesn´t show in screenshots as they are fixed, but I will try to record a video. Anyway the shader looks really stunning, and I love the opportunity of adjusting overscan

#27

Are the scanlines running vertically like they should be? If not, it could be interlacing jitter if the vertical games are being misrecognized as interlaced content due to the vertical resolution. In this case, you may need to disable the interlacing detection in the user-settings.h file.

If you’re using MAME, you might try running the game through FBA, which actually rotates like it should on vertical games.

#28

Hunterk, i´m running horizontal games, the weirdness occurs only when scrolling is vertical, no matter if the games are horizontal or vertically oriented.

I´ve been having a look and took a screenshot in a specific game where I think that scanline misalignments can be easily spotted. Giga wing level 1, right when one big explosion makes the background yellow. When that happens, with Crt Kurozumi, I can clearly see some thicker scanlines or weirdness happening (nothing really major here, maybe I´m just being too picky but hey, we´re here for perfection aren´t we?) I dont know if it´s visible on this shot. But hey! last night I went to my trinitron crt, tried Twinbee on the Turbo Duo and i could also spot some of this weirdness. That´s why I think it must be moiree effect or whatever.

I have read somewhere that vertical scrolling is not crt´s best feature

With my other favorite crt shader (crt hyllian multipass) it doesn´t happen.

My settings are: integer scaling on (a given), custom viewport (1440x1160) bilinear off vsync on

#29

You need to use an even integer multiple on the vertical axis.

#30

which are the correct values?

#31

It depends on the core/game. Is there a reason you’re using custom viewport?

#32

Nope. I just like a larger screen, and can live with some overscan. What would be the ideal settings for you, hunterk? Considering that i dont want to have borders over and under the image, as happens if I select “core provided”… which resolves the issue

#33

Try setting your custom viewport’s y value to an even integer multiple of 240 (if you’re on a 1080p screen, try 1200) and turn off ‘crop overscan’. It probably won’t be perfect for all arcade games but it should be pretty close.

#34

Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem good for my Sony FWD-S47H1 monitor. It’s 47", so turning up the backlight so high seems to get it really hot and I start hearing the fans humming inside, working to cool it off. I don’t know much about monitors and I’m not saying it isn’t working as intended. It’s just that I need to preserve it’s life as long as I can, since the monitor is irreplaceable (for me at least). lol. Maybe I’m just being OCD, but I don’t like hearing those fan(s).

Really sucks though, because the backlight method with 0.50 level_contrast, I was able to get CRT-Royale looking the best I’ve seen. So, if you have an option that would be second best for compensating for lowering the contrast… lemme know! Thanks.

#35

[QUOTE=∞Phantasm;38876]Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem good for my Sony FWD-S47H1 monitor. It’s 47", so turning up the backlight so high seems to get it really hot and I start hearing the fans humming inside, working to cool it off. I don’t know much about monitors and I’m not saying it isn’t working as intended. It’s just that I need to preserve it’s life as long as I can, since the monitor is irreplaceable (for me at least). lol. Maybe I’m just being OCD, but I don’t like hearing those fan(s).[/quote]Isn’t that a signage display specifically designed to go bright and run 24/7? The fan is there to ensure that it doesn’t overheat. Of course the harder you push any display, the shorter it will last. Running the display at a high brightness shouldn’t cut its life short, but it probably would last longer at lower brightness settings.

[QUOTE=∞Phantasm;38876]Really sucks though, because the backlight method with 0.50 level_contrast, I was able to get CRT-Royale looking the best I’ve seen. So, if you have an option that would be second best for compensating for lowering the contrast… lemme know! Thanks.[/QUOTE]Anything else that you do is achieving the higher brightness level by adjusting the gamma or introducing clipping, either of which are going to distort the image in some way. If it’s not bright enough for you, raising levels_contrast is really your only option.

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#36

All right hunter, this really solves the issue. I guess it´s something similar to the geometry adjustments when you set up a real CRT for gaming.

Now, what I´d like to know is whether or not it´s possible to create per game configurations including custom viewports. After what you told me, i´m now using a 1120 Y axis (224x5) really fixes this stuff for almost all of the arcade games, and I guess I won´t spot any of these issues on Snes and Md as well (i didn´t have much time to try, just had a look at the “giga wing spot” ). I think you can only create configs per core. Am I right?

Thank you anyway, it really looks stunning now with properly even scanlines and no wavy scanlines or whatever that was happening… was that moiree effect?

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#37

It is. You can create per-core or per-game overrides. Here’s my post which explains how this is set up, after getting everything figured out: http://libretro.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5475&p=36962&viewfull=1#post36962

Here’s the template that I’m using now:

#  0 is 4:3
#  1 is 16:9
#  7 is 3:2
#  8 is 3:4
# 19 is Config (video_aspect_ratio)
# 20 is 1:1 PAR
# 21 is Core Provided (typically 4:3)
# 22 is Custom Viewport

aspect_ratio_index = "21"
video_aspect_ratio = "-1.000000"

custom_viewport_width = "256"
custom_viewport_height = "224"
custom_viewport_x = "832"
custom_viewport_y = "428"

video_crop_overscan = "true"
video_scale_integer = "false"

video_shader = ":\shaders\shaders_cg\retro\pixellate.cgp"
#38

if 1120 is working for you, you can enable crop overscan and it should give you that same 224 res for SNES. Genplusgx should be 224, as well, as long as the border core options are disabled. Nestopia has similar overscan toggles in the core options and should give you 224 with all of them disabled. You may have to do some fiddling with the mednafen-* cores’ first/last scanline options but you can do all of that on a per-game basis from the GUI (use the ‘create game options’ or whatever it’s called from the core options menu).

#39

[QUOTE=larch1991;38891]Isn’t that a signage display specifically designed to go bright and run 24/7? The fan is there to ensure that it doesn’t overheat. Of course the harder you push any display, the shorter it will last. Running the display at a high brightness shouldn’t cut its life short, but it probably would last longer at lower brightness settings.

Anything else that you do is achieving the higher brightness level by adjusting the gamma or introducing clipping, either of which are going to distort the image in some way. If it’s not bright enough for you, raising levels_contrast is really your only option.[/QUOTE]

Yeah I believe so. It’s a “commercial” monitor, probably something you’d see at the wall on an airport and stuff. I really like it, even though it doesn’t have the best black levels and it’s only 60hz. Alright thanks. I might just use the high brightness when I play, but I literally have to turn it all the way up. What do you mean by “clipping” exactly?

#40

Colors are represented with red, green and blue values from 0-255, with zero meaning ‘black’ and 255 meaning pure red/green/blue (if all three are maxed, you get white). Let’s pretend you have a screen of R=100, G=20 and B=200 (that’s a royal purple color but it doesn’t really matter).

Now, we cut the screen’s overall brightness by approximately half for the scanline effect by making every other line pure black (0,0,0). So, to get the whole-screen-average brightness back to what we expect, we would have to double the values of R, G and B. Ok, R becomes 200 and G becomes 40 and that’s fine, but B should become 400, which is obviously greater than the maximum value of 255. That extra 145 ticks gets clipped because it can’t go any higher. So, instead of being the same color but brighter, we end up with a totally different color.

Now, imagine we had a similar situation but R=200, G=225 and B=230 (that’s a sky blue). In the same process, all three color values get clipped into 255, 255, 255, or bright white. Same goes for R=230, G=225, B=200 (a sandy tan color), which also becomes 255, 255, 255, or bright white. This is really bad if you’re showing a beach scene, since it all turns into white!

If you try to fiddle with the contrast, you end up with the opposite problem, where all of your dark colors become the same dark gray / black, and this phenomenon is known as “crushed” blacks.

^^this post is an oversimplification used for illustration purposes.

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