Wow! Thank God for the humongous strides made in motion interpolation and judder removal technology!
Based on this you might be very disappointed by the fact that your shiny new tandem OLED TV may or may not work with existing subpixel layouts.
You might actually be a good candidate to be a guinea pig to test and add proper working mask layouts for these new displays?
Why the Panasonic and not the LG G5 though, which is brighter and reportedly has better gaming features?
Pretty much everything they’re saying about the Panasonic over at AVS Forums. I think you watch the HDTVTest YouTube channel too?
Also LG seems like they aren’t even trying when it comes to calibration anymore. (I’m just parroting this off of articles I’ve read though TBH) At this age, I watch more movies than play games.
TBH I don’t understand subpixel layouts. :x My other friend got a Bravia 8 II, but he lives kinda far and isn’t as picky with the shaders as I am, and then I’m not as picky as a lot of people I respect around here. I wish I could loop him into helping you though.
I think you might have a certain affinity towards Panasonic and if so, there’s nothing wrong with that. Do enjoy your TV when you get it!
Yes, I look at that from time to time as well as many others. Note that HDTV Test arrived at a different result in the Overall Best TV of 2024 compared to the Value Electronics Shootout by Stop The FOMO and Brian’s Tech Therapy. So don’t be surprised if they arrive at a different result this year as well.
One thing about LG is that they tend to support their flagship TVs for a very long time so It’s very likely that anything that might be off with that particular model will be rectified in due course.
This is what actual owners have had to say about the G5:
https://www.reddit.com/r/LGOLED/s/fR5z0ZcYvg
I’m sure there’s an explanation here somewhere but I sent you a Link to the “OLED Subpixel, How Do They Work?” Thread so you might be able to learn a little from there.
You might have heard in the past that a pixel is the smallest element of a digital image or display. However each of those pixels are made up of smaller elements of individual colour called subpixels. The combination of the subpixel colours determine the final colour of each pixel.
What we try to do here is allow these subpixels to be analogous to the phosphors on a CRT. However CRTs mostly had they phosphors in an R-G-B layout in that order, but only some modern displays share that subpixel layout so we may not always be able to map to a CRT’s R-G-B phosphor layout 1:1.
Depending on the layout of the display, we might use BGR instead or RBG.
QD-OLED is not even in the question because of the shape of its subpixel layout, it wouldn’t be able to map 1:1 with any CRT Layout.
So it took a while before we figured out how to get acceptable phosphor to subpixel mapping on WOLED TVs. With this new RGB tandem OLED, the layout is different so either one of the other existing mappings might work or we might need to create a new mapping.
Hi Cyber,
If we are stuck with a QD-OLED monitor for now (I’m going to trade it in for one of those new AOC Mini LED for better HDR experience eventually), what are the best settings to change to mitigate the subpixel mismatch issue?
Something else that happened, when I updated RA from 1.20 Stable to 1.21 Stable, it broke a lot of your shader presets, specifically the 4k HDR presets. Like, distorted colours, blurry, etc. I tried installing 1.20 again but they were still broken…Weird issue, might be just me (I also get constant crashes upon game load on 1.21 with certain cores now), just thought to bring it up in case others have it.
Thanks!
Pioneer, and Sony actually. I guess I had a Panasonic VCR back in the 90s??? But I’m just not big on QD-OLED with their fringing and magenta push. Definitely disliked that on the QD-OLED PC monitors I’ve tried. Samsung forcing exaggerated saturation and avoiding Dolby Vision is an instant disqualifier ofc. (I keep accidentally winding up with DV encoded files which makes it a desirable feature) Sony has better SDR color accuracy and apparently the processors do more accurate upscaling, but I just watch over media files on my PC so…I’m not hooking a cable box or an NES up to it or something like that. Maybe 2026 Sony will not be using a QD-OLED panel and then I’ll wait another year for their sale, but I feel like they’re sticking with QD.
When it comes to speakers the Z95B’s 170W 5.1.2 sound difference is no comparison, I presume to help people avoid needing a separate soundbar purchase? But I use an external 5.1 speaker setup anyway so that’s not factoring in…
But because you brought it up, I went and checked the game modes; what am I missing here? 12.6ms input lag on the Z95B, 12.9ms input lag on the G5… FPS/RPG settings in Sound Mode…and 60hz mode that pushes input lag down to 8.6ms. CRT’s have 8.3ms input delay. Apparently the Z95B can further reduce input lag to 4.8ms with 120Hz signals.
I tried to go find the comparable interface for the G5 and I just find tons of videos saying it’s cooked for gaming. u.u I’m not educated on that, so DYOR.
HDTVTest explained what True Game Mode is on the Z95B here:
This is what @MajorPainTheCactus had to say about QD-OLED subpixel CRT mask emulation:
Just be careful and do your research because all miniLED displays are not the same and there are many factors can make or break the experience.
There’s no perfect TV for CRT Shader emulation yet in my opinion. Let’s hope you don’t miss the advantages of OLED when you “upgrade”.
I’ve been using 1.20 and then 1.21 for ages now. I doubt that would have broken my presets.
What might “break” presets or rather cause them to look differently than intended is if you updated your Slang_Shaders using the Online Updater without first backing up and then restoring the relevant/required versions of the shader for the particular preset pack.
If you read near the download links to the packs in the first post, it specifies these things in the installation instructions.
For my Mega Bezel Preset Pack you need Mega Bezel 1.14.0.
For my Sony Megatron Colour Video Monitor Preset Packs the version of CRT-Guest-Advanced is also specified.
Only my very first Sony Megatron Colour Video Monitor should be affected by an Online Update of the Slang Shaders though as all my other Sony Megatron preset packs look for the Guest Advanced shader in a different folder from its default installation folder.
From my Sony Megatron W420M Preset pack onwards, there’s no need to separately install the CRT-Guest-Advanced shader because it’s included.
I’m not sure why your games would be crashing. Perhaps you might need to also update your cores or do a roll back of the cores that no longer work as well.
As always sharing a log file using Pastebin will always help with getting to the bottom of these kinds of issues.
Also, if you want to downgrade RetroArch, you first need to rename or delete the retroarch.exe file.
It seems like Panasonic really hit it out of the park this year with this TV. I wasn’t so impressed by their return to the US market last year though. Notwithstanding, in the context of shaders and presets which rely on the TV to brute force brightness through heavy (near opaque) mask and scanline settings, brightness will always tend to be a priority. So it remains to be seen which of the TVs is better for CRT shader emulation.
I would like some assistance in testing the new subpixel layout though.
On another note:
Your thinking is almost exactly like mine on these points. Raised black levels in a bright room means QD-OLED (at least in it’s current form) is definitely not for me and after waiting with bated breath to see if it would have launched with a “proper” striped RGB subpixel layout, they came up with this pentile triangular nonsense that has no relevance whatsoever to what we’re trying to accomplish here. Then you’ve said it already, no Dolby Vision. Samsung’s processing looks oversaturated and under detailed.
Probably just the 4 HDMI 2.1 ports on the LG G5 (as well as other models) vs only 2 on the Z95B (one of which doubles as the EARC port).
Gamers with a beefy gaming PC might lean more towards the LG G5 , thanks to its support for refresh rates up to 165Hz (excluding the 48-inch and 97-inch models) and VRR support in the form of AMD FreeSync and Nvidia G-Sync across all four HDMI 2.1 ports. The Panasonic Z95B has a very respectable but slightly lower 144Hz refresh rate with FreeSync VRR support, but only two HDMI 2.1 ports. Both televisions support 4K/120Hz gaming on the latest generation consoles, with minimal latency.
Vincent’s conclusion here sort of aligns with what I said about the potential for manufacturers to iron out their TVs’ initial flaws over time via firmware updates:
I like the way Panasonic caps the Peak Luminance based on the content Metadata though in an effort to limit the white subpixel diluting the colour saturation.
Same page re: last years Panasonic lol. Vincent’s video there seems to show the subpixel for the Z95B doesn’t it? Looks like RGB and not BGR. It’s on sale on Amazon so I think I’ll do the monthly payments cause Shaders are my big hobby now and who knows where my mind will be (or if alive) next year.
I haven’t bought a new TV since the HD CRT Sony over 20 years ago…after I replaced it with the PRO-111FD for a lucky $300, I hoped to never buy a TV again. ;p
You’ll have to teach me what I’m supposed to be looking for in regards to subpixel layout signs. Even now I can hardly tell the difference on my Kuro Elite but BGR seems to look worse by about 0.01% on a Guest Advanced slot mask by RetroCrisis.
This was Panasonic’s Plasma subpixel layout, and remember Plasma’s have phosphors so I don’t know how they’ve been spoilers my presets or not:
Yes, it was shown and the layout is known, however I’m not a Shader dev nor someone who fully understands how the interaction between the displays subpixel colours and the masks and I came in after the experts were laying the foundations of what we have today but I’m a person who finds a way to figure out how to achieve what I want with whatever tools I have available inclusive of my determination coupled with lots of trial and error. So while I might have theories as to what might work, they would need to be tested.
What messes with the mask in WOLED is the extra white subpixel. So that leads to weird spacing and alignment issues with Masks which were designed with only 3 subpixels in mind.
I don’t think any CRT Shader Mask layouts were designed with OLED TVs in mind and it was sort of by accident as well as some intense trial and error that some existing mask Layout and TVL combinations just happened to work on WOLED.
Yeah, don’t worry, when we reach that bridge I’ll know what to ask.
Plasma TVs as well as most shaders and presets that aim for high brightness in the SDR realm usually compromise a lot in the mask and scanlines accuracy and detail, especially the colour accuracy, opacity and definition of the emulated mask and phosphors themselves.
To some this doesn’t seem important as you can’t make out those details like individual RGB phosphors from normal viewing distances anyway, right?
They are the building blocks and foundations of a CRT’s image though and when you start straying from there and start “diluting” the foundation, it would affect the final image.
With these things though ignorance is bliss and for some there’s a lot of variance as to what they find acceptable, good, great, awesome, nostalgic e.t.c.
Well this is an example of a subpixel shot that might be useful when you get your Z95B but as for Plasma, that’s beyond my scope. Even the G5/Z95B/RGB Tandem OLED is to some extent because I tend to make presets for the displays I use personally.
If you’re interested in researching CRT Shaders and Plasma, there should at least be some information by @Nesguy who used a Plasma TV at some point and shared a lot of knowledge about the operation of CRTs and how to get shaders to get closer and closer to how they looked and much more available in these forums.
Ah yes. The same tools I use to script. Hammers! Just keep hammering away and if that doesn’t work, try the other hammer!
Hammers. Big hammers. Small hammers. MC Hammers ♫
You do actually get to learn a lot along the way though and this is not to say that I didn’t already start off with or have not been constantly increasing my technical knowledge at the same time.
This video sums up some of the issues we are faced with today as we search for the perfect display for CRT Emulation.
It’s basically that stuff that really helped me keep away from FOMO. The PRO-111FD’s 12-bit panel’s Deep Color is enough for MadVR’s Tonemapping to simulate the look of HDR, yeah I don’t hit that high nit contrast, but when I watch on my friends QD-OLED, I see I’m getting 90% of the experience. It’s “only 90% as breathtaking” on my display.
Kuro’s feel like the perfect SDR panels, oddly I can’t quite hit the same “true black” levels on my backup KRP-500M…but basically if anything happens to my PRO-111FD I’ve got this other Plasma that a lot of people consider to be better, and I’ll figure it out then cause I definitely know how the service menus work really well by now. (This is assuming I don’t stick with this Z95B - which I guess will be determined by how sensitive I am to its “significantly reduced” temporal dithering and chrominance overshoot. I watch a lot of mooveezanteevee so I’ll know within that return window if I’m bothered and should return it or not. I can keep you posted in this thread if interested.)
SDR:
MadVR’s HDR tonemapping:
So it’s basically like I’m doing this purely to see what I can do with 1440p and 4K shaders.
Hello Cyber!
First of all, thank you very much for taking your time to develop these presets, they seem wonderful.
I recently got a 4K HDR 144Hz QD- OLED TV (Samsung S90D) and thought it would be perfect to try some CRT simulation shaders with. However, as a relative newcomer, I am a bit confused. I simply don’t know what to use, exactly, and/or what settings to tweak. Ideally, I want something that requires as little tweaking as possible while looking good.
What do you suggest, exactly, in terms of what presets and settings to use?
I wouldn’t consider that the perfect display for these types of things though.
All the steps are there, telling you how to use each preset pack. You just have to go down the rabbit hole. If you’ve read but you don’t understand something specifically then you can feel free to post a question.
There are so many, how do I even choose?
I strongly suggest you read the first post of this thread, including watching the videos. That should at least leave you with an idea of what can be done and you might see something that you might want to try.
Be sure to also read the readme files inside the preset packs even if they might be a bit outdated.
Eventually things might start to sink in and seem more familiar.
Based on what @MajorPainTheCactus said he uses for his QD-OLED Display, be sure to change the Display’s Subpixel Layout/Mask Layout to RGB.
Just play around randomly with the presets and preset packs like you’re in a sandbox. Don’t be overwhelmed just because you’ll be spoilt for choice.
Also, you can use any preset pack on any TV, not because one says miniLED means it’s for miniLED, that’s just what it was made on. Same goes for presets with OLED in the name.
No presets were made for or on a QD-OLED though. OLED in this context refers to WOLED and more specifically RWGB WOLED.
QD-OLED displays in their current form don’t map to current subpixel CRT shaders but some might say it is good enough.
Phew, what’s the best pack to use with my OLED 4K HDR? So which pack should I download? Which is the latest pack?
It really doesn’t work like that. All of the preset packs have a range of presets, some better than others and also different in certain ways. Within each preset pack the newer ones and the ones with the most elaborate descriptions might tend to be the most refined.
There are presets in any of the packs that would look great on your OLED TV so just play around with them, explore and have fun.
My CRT-Royale Preset pack was designed on an OLED TV but the shader doesn’t align properly with OLED subpixel layouts so they won’t look true to a CRT if you get right up to the screen.
Other than that, for Presets based on Mega Bezel/CRT-Guest-Advanced, you’ll want to ensure that the Mask Layout is set to BGR - 1 and for Sony Megatron Colour Video Monitor based presets you’ll want to ensure that the Display’s Subpixel Layout is set to RWGB (OLED) - 1.
For OLED also make sure that the Mask Accurate/Colour Accurate Parameter is set to 0.
Definitely read the first post and watch the videos. You’ll notice the dates next to each download which should indicate which are the latest.
My first Sony Megatron Colour Video Monitor preset pack focused on Aperture Grille presets, the second one, the first NX preset pack, featured mostly Slot Mask presets and the third one, NX (W420M) features mainly Shadow (Dot) Mask presets.
After that, you’ll get a mix of CRT Mask types in my miniLED presets packs.
My miniLED Epic preset pack is my latest and as a result most refined preset pack but that doesn’t mean that I didn’t get certain things right in my older preset packs or that there’s nothing experimental going on in my newer presets packs.
You can also look through the screenshot in the thread, take note of the presets and preset packs that might interest you and go from there.
Feel free to ask more questions if you need. Just remember to post pics when you do.
Other notable mentions include my Mega Bezel preset pack and within that pack, my Neo-GX presets and my 4K HDR Ready presets.
Okay, I understand. So, it’s a matter of exploring and experimenting. Thank you for your input. 
To a certain extent, yes. You see, you asked “what’s the best pack to use with your OLED 4K HDR?”
In my opinion, there isn’t really any “best” pack because each one brings something different to the table so they might tend to suit different usage scenarios but also might be able to be used in a more all purpose manner.
Some of my best and most refined presets were made using the Mega Bezel Shader, so I can’t say that because they might be older, they’re obsolete or not as good as what I’m working on now.
Then at the same time, sometimes I might be seeing and working on flaws, issues, problems which I might have never noticed before in older presets, in some cases, that might relegate a group of presets with that flaw into the experimental category but that doesn’t necessarily mean that all presets of that era, suffer from the same issues and sometimes great things have come about when I’ve experimented and tried different things.
Sometimes I reinvent the wheel on purpose or continue from where I left off, even if I might have been relatively satisfied before. If you look at more screenshots, you’ll see that the category of best can’t just be limited to the latest.
If you like reflective borders, you might want to try or stick with my Mega Bezel or Uborder preset packs.
If you don’t, then perhaps, one of my Sony Megatron or CRT-Royale Preset packs might be more suited to you.
If you have a problem with sifting through too many presets, then maybe my Epic, Neo-GX_Ultra or 4K HDR Presets might be for you.
If you don’t have a powerful enough GPU, then maybe my Sony Megatron preset packs, in particular my first one might be a better suited for you.
The last presets I made on an OLED TV are my Near Field Presets, you’ll find those in my Sony Megatron NX presets pack and my NX W420M Preset packs.
However, most of my presets in my Mega Bezel preset. Pack were made on an OLED TV. There are even presets with IV OLED in the filename.
The entire Mega Bezel Neo-GX preset sub pack were designed on an OLED TV.
If you read the entire first post, you’ll see some of what’s capable using the preset packs. Be sure to read the readme files for even more useful tips even though they might be a bit long in the tooth at this point.
With all of that said, “Designed on an OLED”, still doesn’t mean that some presets wouldn’t look better on a miniLED with higher brightness or that a preset that was designed on a miniLED won’t look better on an OLED TV/Display than one designed on an OLED TV/Display.
Hello. There’s a video on YouTube where a person shows how to launch the game using a combination of Duimon Mega Bezel / Cyberlab Mega bezel Death to pixel shaders. Is there a video tutorial on how to do this? I’m interested in trying it myself.
