Thanks. Yeah I agree with how it looks better. Like I said before it looks like it adds just a little bit of fuzz to break up the harsh edges but not fuzzing it all out making it blurry.
[QUOTE=larch1991;39408]The problem is that the number of triads a display can handle varies depending on its resolution. lordmonkus was having problems at 1440p, and it looks just as bad if not worse at 2160p When creating a preset, I think itās important to select values that will work universally. [ā¦] [/QUOTE]
Oh boy, thatās a pity, of course, youāre right. My goal just was to get it as authentic as possible, and i really hoped 4k was enough to display it correctly, but yeah, if itās a preset for the masses, of course it should work on all the variety of resolutions etc. , that anybody can use it without getting problems at all thumbs up !
But as you got 2160p resolution, iām just corious, does num_triads_desired in half resolution (value 1080) look broken? Edit: Or if that doesnāt work, can you post a 2160p screenshot with number of triads 2? Would be nice if thatās possible, thanks!
Edit again: Sorry for editing, but i just realized that larch nailed , what i was trying to say. Has anybody in here seen a BVM performing in reality? If you look really closely on the screens, they basically look this screenshot from larch. If you zoom out of it on a lower res screen it basically looks like my preset:
This one looks FAKE, well at least on 2160p, the bvms were never that artificially smoothā¦:
The problem with that of course, if you run 1080p or 1200p for example, triad size 3 doesnāt look right, because itās way too coarseā¦ Is it possible to get the number of triads āself adjustingā, that every resolution gets kinda the right look?
[QUOTE=Kurozumi;39424]Oh boy, thatās a pity, of course, youāre right. My goal just was to get it as authentic as possible, and i really hoped 4k was enough to display it correctly, but yeah, if itās a preset for the masses, of course it should work on all the variety of resolutions etc. , that anybody can use it without getting problems at all thumbs up !
But as you got 2160p resolution, iām just corious, does num_triads_desired in half resolution (value 1080) look broken? Edit: Or if that doesnāt work, can you post a 2160p screenshot with number of triads 2? Would be nice if thatās possible, thanks![/QUOTE]I tried a bunch of different values and most of them had problems. The only thing that worked if youāre trying to lower the apparent resolution is to increase the triad size. 4 seemed to produce a reasonable result, going higher than that just ended up being too low resolution.
Again, this is not something that Iād change globally for a preset, just something that you might want to tweak if you have a 2160p display.
[QUOTE=Kurozumi;39424]This one looks FAKE, well at least on 2160p, the bvms were never that artificially smoothā¦:[/quote]Yes, itās smoother than Iād like at 2160p. However I think it looks fine at lower resolutions because your displayās own pixels add a mask to the image.
[QUOTE=Kurozumi;39424]The problem with that of course, if you run 1080p or 1200p for example, triad size 3 doesnāt look right, because itās way too coarseā¦ Is it possible to get the number of triads āself adjustingā, that every resolution gets kinda the right look?[/QUOTE]I donāt think itās really possible at 1200p or lower. Youāre limited by the resolution of the display. But again, as the display resolution gets lower, there is less need to add a mask effect via the shader because your display has a visible pixel structure of its own.
[QUOTE=larch1991;39425] [ā¦] Again, this is not something that Iād change globally for a preset, just something that you might want to tweak if you have a 2160p display.
Yes, itās smoother than Iād like at 2160p. However I think it looks fine at lower resolutions because your displayās own pixels add a mask to the image.
I donāt think itās really possible at 1200p or lower. Youāre limited by the resolution of the display. But again, as the display resolution gets lower, there is less need to add a mask effect via the shader because your display has a visible pixel structure of its own.[/QUOTE]
I think the best option then is to turn the triad size not specified and to 1 (thats what 1920 is, isnāt it?)
Yeah, donāt get me wrong, or call me weird or wicked (maybe i am?!?), for myself itās just a bit like the Gameboy shader. If you play tetris and throw that thing on, it just looks, like it did back when it was released, thatās the look and it looks right to a lot of people.
My whole reason i really hardly tried to get the BVM look(besides i got no space for a giant crt) is, that i can use any digital display, and boom it looks ārightā like the GB-shader looks right, just on a huger screen 
.
Didnāt try it yet, but are the settings on CRT-royale ākurozumi-editionā (i feel honored somehow, i really didnāt know, that anybody would use/like my settings!) hard-coded/unadjustable? Or is it just CRT-royale with pre set parameters? Because i personally think there are some things that never should be fixed. F.e. geometry, not everyone likes CRT-geometry simulation, not everybody likes that. The same i think about the triads, if i am not possible to get the BVM look on a 4k or 8k screen, because it gets smooth/flat at that detail level, it would miss the whole point, because it looks as wrong, as 50% darkened lines āfake scanlinesā look.
My brain is just thinking alot right nowā¦
Perhaps the solution is to have two presets. Once you get to 1440p, letting the shader determine the number of triads to use looks pretty good. (triad size 3) Below 1440p I prefer to set it as high as possible to minimize - but not eliminate - the mask simulation. Reducing the size to 1 and specifying 1920 triads just makes them as small as possible to ensure that this happens.
Oh, and I would also set:
geom_radius = "1024.000000"
geom_view_dist = "1024.000000"
This basically eliminates any distortion from the geometry shader, while leaving it enabled to have the higher level of anti-aliasing applied.
Hm, on 1440p i would go mask size 1, too, thatās way to coarse for the hires BVMs, but it has something to it on itās ownā¦ I guess one preset with triad Size one does it. Maybe one thatās the usual CRT Royale, just with the parameters set?
It makes me really happy, that you/we have fixed the preset for basically every display resolution/aspect ratio i guess? Thanks for that, i really missed the wood for the trees, i guess! I should try that on the low-res triniton profile i tried to create, maybe that fixes it, too?
Not in the preset but you could conceivably modify the actual shader to have something based on IN.output_size.
[QUOTE=Kurozumi;39432]Hm, on 1440p i would go mask size 1, too, thatās way to coarse for the hires BVMs, but it has something to it on itās ownā¦[/quote]Yeah, youāre not simulating a 900 or 1000 TVL trinitron with a 1440p display, but itās probably in the region of 700-800 TVL. Definitely higher resolution that a 600 TVL PVM.
Hi again guys
I have been doing my research on the shader, compared with a real high quality Sony Trinitron that I have here and this thing looks absolutely stunning. ItĀ“s the ultimate Crt shader to me, and I really like how configurable it is, the overscan controlsā¦ I love it
IĀ“d need advice on two aspects. First one is how I make this look natural for vertical games. Is the shader rotatable or something? For vertical games iĀ“m using a 5x scale factor on both X and Y axis (can live with the overscan) and integer multiples of the desired resolutions. Looks brilliant now, but not for vertical games. What should I do?
On the other hand IĀ“d need further clarification as to how pero game overrides work. They are needed for MAME as it manages so many different resolutions, and I would need to specify custom viewport on per game overrides, but i cannot get them to work. I donĀ“t know how I sould name the cfg folders and the files.
@fogueman: Yeah Iām not sure why there is no vertical or flip option in CRT-Royaleā¦ unless there is some way to do it that isnāt obvious to me, I donāt think you can. Someone should definitely make that an option, thoughā¦ for arcade games that had tated displays.
You can use RetroArchās settings > video > rotation option but it doesnāt look all that great with this shader.
Thatās for rotating the whole screen for a tated monitor, thoughā¦ we need to rotate the shader. Iām sure it would be easy just to add rotation option to the actual shader with an on/off option, if you know how to script those shaders.
EDIT: I donāt know if it would look good using that method but there is a way if someone knows how.
Heh, itās more complicated than you might expect, even on a simple shader, and crt-royale is definitely not simple.
[QUOTE=fogueman;40059]Hi again guys
I have been doing my research on the shader, compared with a real high quality Sony Trinitron that I have here and this thing looks absolutely stunning. ItĀ“s the ultimate Crt shader to me, and I really like how configurable it is, the overscan controlsā¦ I love it
IĀ“d need advice on two aspects. First one is how I make this look natural for vertical games. Is the shader rotatable or something? For vertical games iĀ“m using a 5x scale factor on both X and Y axis (can live with the overscan) and integer multiples of the desired resolutions. Looks brilliant now, but not for vertical games. What should I do?
On the other hand IĀ“d need further clarification as to how pero game overrides work. They are needed for MAME as it manages so many different resolutions, and I would need to specify custom viewport on per game overrides, but i cannot get them to work. I donĀ“t know how I sould name the cfg folders and the files.[/QUOTE]
Hereās an example of one of my per-game configs. (Metal Slug 2)
video_shader = ":\shaders\shaders_cg\cgp\crt-royale-kurozumi.cgp"
# 0 is 4:3
# 1 is 16:9
# 7 is 3:2
# 8 is 3:4
# 19 is Config (video_aspect_ratio)
# 20 is 1:1 PAR
# 21 is Core Provided
# 22 is Custom Viewport
aspect_ratio_index = "19"
video_aspect_ratio = "1.4035087719298245614035087719298"
custom_viewport_width = "320"
custom_viewport_height = "224"
custom_viewport_x = "800"
custom_viewport_y = "428"
video_crop_overscan = "true"
video_scale_integer = "false"
video_rotation = "0"
It has to be saved as :\configs<core name><rom name>.cfg e.g. :\configs\MAME\mslug2.cfg
90Ā° games are a pain. The only thing Iāve found to work for those, is to set up both MAME and RetroArch to do 90Ā° rotation, which means creating two config files in different locations.
See below for a better solution to rotate vertical MAME games by default.
Note: on my 1080p screen, the default Kurozumi preset looks really bad when rotated. I have to set all the convergence values to 0 or else I get bad discoloration.
you can do RetroArch\system\mame\ini\vertical.ini
Inside of it: ror 1 (will rotate right 90Ā°) or rol 1 (will rotate left 90Ā°)
Will do it for every vertical games.
Need a solution for the retroarch rotation nowā¦ (got //video_rotation = ā1ā //video_shader = ā:\shaders\02-crt-curved-V.cgpā in mame.cfg atm that needs manual activation)
[QUOTE=Tatsuya79;40116]you can do RetroArch\system\mame\ini\vertical.ini
Inside of it: ror 1 (will rotate right 90Ā°) or rol 1 (will rotate left 90Ā°)
Will do it for every vertical games.[/quote]That doesnāt seem to do anything here. EDIT: In your retroarch-core-options.cfg you need to set mame_read_config = āenabledā
[QUOTE=Tatsuya79;40116]Need a solution for the retroarch rotation nowā¦ (got //video_rotation = ā1ā //video_shader = ā:\shaders\02-crt-curved-V.cgpā in mame.cfg atm that needs manual activation)[/QUOTE] :\config\MAME\MAME.cfg should work as long as you have āload override files automaticallyā ENABLED and āconfiguration per-coreā DISABLED. However that will apply to all games, not just vertical games.
[QUOTE=larch1991;40118] :\config\MAME\MAME.cfg should work as long as you have āload override files automaticallyā ENABLED and āconfiguration per-coreā DISABLED. However that will apply to all games, not just vertical games.[/QUOTE] Thatās what Iām doing, thatās why Iāve got the // to put or remove depending which game orientation Iām playing. It would be awesome to have a working āvertical.cfgā there.
Tried it in the last few days on different displays (TV and PC Monitors) with Triad_Size_desired -> 1 ; and Specify Num Triads -> off (0). On all the displays it looked amazingly sharp, thatās really a nice feature! And Since i had 8 different displays here , i calibrated them all to ITU709+BT1886 at 100cd. After that i tried to get the best balance between CRT Glow and Color Authenticity / less compressed colors on all displays. On lower resolution screens i noticed that the geometry setting did impact the sharpness, so i disabled that, too. Iām really excited about the fact, that iām / we are able to tweak this setting further !
Settings i really really liked the last few days: crt_gamma = ā2.500000ā lcd_gamma = ā2.400000ā levels_contrast = ā0.750000ā halation_weight = ā0.000000ā diffusion_weight = ā0.010000ā bloom_underestimate_levels = ā0.800000ā bloom_excess = ā0.000000ā beam_min_sigma = ā0.02000ā beam_max_sigma = ā0.200000ā beam_spot_power = ā0.370000ā beam_min_shape = ā2.000000ā beam_max_shape = ā4.000000ā beam_shape_power = ā0.250000ā beam_horiz_filter = ā0.000000ā beam_horiz_sigma = ā0.545000ā beam_horiz_linear_rgb_weight = ā1.000000ā convergence_offset_x_r = ā0.000000ā convergence_offset_x_g = ā0.000000ā convergence_offset_x_b = ā0.000000ā convergence_offset_y_r = ā0.100000ā convergence_offset_y_g = ā-0.100000ā convergence_offset_y_b = ā0.100000ā mask_type = ā0.000000ā mask_sample_mode_desired = ā0.000000ā mask_specify_num_triads = ā0.000000ā mask_triad_size_desired = ā1.000000ā mask_num_triads_desired = ā900.000000ā aa_subpixel_r_offset_x_runtime = ā-0.333333ā aa_subpixel_r_offset_y_runtime = ā0.000000ā aa_cubic_c = ā0.500000ā aa_gauss_sigma = ā0.500000ā geom_mode = ā3.000000ā geom_radius = ā3.000000ā geom_view_dist = ā2.000000ā geom_tilt_angle_x = ā0.000000ā geom_tilt_angle_y = ā0.000000ā geom_aspect_ratio_x = ā432.000000ā geom_aspect_ratio_y = ā329.000000ā geom_overscan_x = ā1.000000ā geom_overscan_y = ā1.000000ā border_size = ā0.005000ā border_darkness = ā0.000000ā border_compress = ā2.500000ā interlace_bff = ā0.000000ā interlace_1080i = "0.000000
Is there a reason for the convergence settings? Ideally, they should all be zero.
The convergence setting is on all iterations of them, and yes there is a reason. All BVMs i have seen in person, even if they came back from service/recalibration, had always this thing going on. For example, if you have a black screen with white text, and you look closely, then thereās a little bit magenta on the bottom and green on the top of each line. Just a nitty gritty detail that i wanted to get in there right from the start. Maybe itās just me, but it really bugged me everytime it was not there.
Thatās why i made all the settings with the convergence offset , itās more authentic that way (well, at least for me)!