LOL 
Are you referring to saturation or scanline saturation in guest-dr-venom?
I seem to get the best results by keeping saturation at default and scanline saturation at 1.00, but it seems like different masks/scanline types like different saturation settings.
Still playing around with Outrun. I think this is showing a good amount of depth, but the downside is that you need a lot of bloom in the bright lines to achieve this. I donāt know if thereās any way to avoid that.
hereās that reference shot again, although this should really only be used as a reference for dynamic range and nothing else.
shaders = "10"
shader0 = "shaders_slang/stock.slang"
filter_linear0 = "false"
wrap_mode0 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input0 = "false"
alias0 = ""
float_framebuffer0 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer0 = "false"
scale_type_x0 = "source"
scale_x0 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y0 = "source"
scale_y0 = "1.000000"
shader1 = "shaders_slang/stock.slang"
filter_linear1 = "true"
wrap_mode1 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input1 = "false"
alias1 = ""
float_framebuffer1 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer1 = "false"
scale_type_x1 = "source"
scale_x1 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y1 = "source"
scale_y1 = "1.000000"
shader2 = "shaders_slang/misc/grade.slang"
filter_linear2 = "true"
wrap_mode2 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input2 = "false"
alias2 = "WhitePointPass"
float_framebuffer2 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer2 = "false"
scale_type_x2 = "source"
scale_x2 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y2 = "source"
scale_y2 = "1.000000"
shader3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/afterglow.slang"
filter_linear3 = "true"
wrap_mode3 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input3 = "false"
alias3 = "AfterglowPass"
float_framebuffer3 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer3 = "false"
scale_type_x3 = "source"
scale_x3 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y3 = "source"
scale_y3 = "1.000000"
shader4 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/avg-lum.slang"
filter_linear4 = "true"
wrap_mode4 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input4 = "true"
alias4 = "AvgLumPass"
float_framebuffer4 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer4 = "false"
scale_type_x4 = "source"
scale_x4 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y4 = "source"
scale_y4 = "1.000000"
shader5 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize.slang"
filter_linear5 = "true"
wrap_mode5 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input5 = "false"
alias5 = "LinearizePass"
float_framebuffer5 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer5 = "false"
scale_type_x5 = "source"
scale_x5 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y5 = "source"
scale_y5 = "1.000000"
shader6 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_horiz.slang"
filter_linear6 = "true"
wrap_mode6 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input6 = "false"
alias6 = ""
float_framebuffer6 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer6 = "false"
scale_type_x6 = "source"
scale_x6 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y6 = "source"
scale_y6 = "1.000000"
shader7 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_vert.slang"
filter_linear7 = "true"
wrap_mode7 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input7 = "false"
alias7 = "GlowPass"
float_framebuffer7 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer7 = "false"
scale_type_x7 = "source"
scale_x7 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y7 = "source"
scale_y7 = "1.000000"
shader8 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize_scanlines.slang"
filter_linear8 = "true"
wrap_mode8 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input8 = "false"
alias8 = ""
float_framebuffer8 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer8 = "false"
scale_type_x8 = "source"
scale_x8 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y8 = "source"
scale_y8 = "1.000000"
shader9 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/crt-guest-dr-venom.slang"
filter_linear9 = "true"
wrap_mode9 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input9 = "false"
alias9 = ""
float_framebuffer9 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer9 = "false"
scale_type_x9 = "viewport"
scale_x9 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y9 = "viewport"
scale_y9 = "1.000000"
parameters = "g_gamma_in;g_signal_type;g_gamma_type;g_crtgamut;g_space_out;g_hue_degrees;g_I_SHIFT;g_Q_SHIFT;g_I_MUL;g_Q_MUL;g_lum_fix;g_vignette;g_vstr;g_vpower;g_lum;g_cntrst;g_mid;wp_temperature;g_sat;g_satr;g_satg;g_satb;g_vibr;g_lift;blr;blg;blb;wlr;wlg;wlb;rg;rb;gr;gb;br;bg;LUT_Size1;LUT1_toggle;LUT_Size2;LUT2_toggle;SW;AR;PR;AG;PG;AB;PB;sat;lsmooth;GAMMA_INPUT;TAPSH;GLOW_FALLOFF_H;TAPSV;GLOW_FALLOFF_V;TATE;IOS;OS;BLOOM;brightboost;brightboost1;gsl;scanline1;scanline2;beam_min;beam_max;beam_size;h_sharp;s_sharp;csize;bsize;warpX;warpY;glow;shadowMask;masksize;vertmask;slotmask;slotwidth;double_slot;slotms;mcut;maskDark;maskLight;CGWG;gamma_out;spike;inter;interm;bloom;scans"
g_gamma_in = "2.500000"
g_signal_type = "1.000000"
g_gamma_type = "1.000000"
g_crtgamut = "2.000000"
g_space_out = "0.000000"
g_hue_degrees = "0.000000"
g_I_SHIFT = "0.000000"
g_Q_SHIFT = "0.000000"
g_I_MUL = "1.000000"
g_Q_MUL = "1.000000"
g_lum_fix = "0.000000"
g_vignette = "0.000000"
g_vstr = "40.000000"
g_vpower = "0.200000"
g_lum = "0.000000"
g_cntrst = "0.000000"
g_mid = "0.500000"
wp_temperature = "6505.000000"
g_sat = "0.000000"
g_satr = "0.000000"
g_satg = "0.000000"
g_satb = "0.000000"
g_vibr = "0.000000"
g_lift = "0.000000"
blr = "0.000000"
blg = "0.000000"
blb = "0.000000"
wlr = "1.100000"
wlg = "1.000000"
wlb = "1.000000"
rg = "0.000000"
rb = "0.000000"
gr = "0.000000"
gb = "0.000000"
br = "0.000000"
bg = "-0.005000"
LUT_Size1 = "16.000000"
LUT1_toggle = "0.000000"
LUT_Size2 = "64.000000"
LUT2_toggle = "0.000000"
SW = "1.000000"
AR = "0.070000"
PR = "0.050000"
AG = "0.070000"
PG = "0.050000"
AB = "0.070000"
PB = "0.050000"
sat = "0.100000"
lsmooth = "0.900000"
GAMMA_INPUT = "2.400000"
TAPSH = "4.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_H = "0.300000"
TAPSV = "4.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_V = "0.300000"
TATE = "0.000000"
IOS = "0.000000"
OS = "1.000000"
BLOOM = "0.000000"
brightboost = "0.500000"
brightboost1 = "1.500001"
gsl = "2.000000"
scanline1 = "15.000000"
scanline2 = "5.000000"
beam_min = "1.350000"
beam_max = "0.650000"
beam_size = "0.000000"
h_sharp = "3.000000"
s_sharp = "1.000000"
csize = "0.000000"
bsize = "600.000000"
warpX = "0.000000"
warpY = "0.000000"
glow = "0.020000"
shadowMask = "3.000000"
masksize = "1.000000"
vertmask = "0.000000"
slotmask = "0.000000"
slotwidth = "2.000000"
double_slot = "1.000000"
slotms = "1.000000"
mcut = "0.250000"
maskDark = "0.500000"
maskLight = "1.500000"
CGWG = "0.300000"
gamma_out = "2.400000"
spike = "1.000000"
inter = "400.000000"
interm = "1.000000"
bloom = "0.000000"
scans = "1.000000"
textures = "SamplerLUT1;SamplerLUT2;SamplerLUT3"
SamplerLUT1 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron1.png"
SamplerLUT1_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT1_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT1_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT2 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron2.png"
SamplerLUT2_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT2_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT2_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/other1.png"
SamplerLUT3_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT3_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT3_mipmap = "false"I donāt think itās that much bloom, tbh.
Looks nice, imo.
@Nesguy I like your shader but of course have my preference. For me the colors are little to on the cool side and the darks a little to harsh which makes some games a bit dark. (Maybe thatās all monitor dependent.) Here is my latest Outrun test and settings. By tomorrow I will unsatisfied with it and wonder what I was thinking.
shaders = "10"
shader0 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/lut.slang"
filter_linear0 = "false"
wrap_mode0 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input0 = "false"
alias0 = ""
float_framebuffer0 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer0 = "false"
scale_type_x0 = "source"
scale_x0 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y0 = "source"
scale_y0 = "1.000000"
shader1 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/color-profiles.slang"
filter_linear1 = "true"
wrap_mode1 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input1 = "false"
alias1 = ""
float_framebuffer1 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer1 = "false"
scale_type_x1 = "source"
scale_x1 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y1 = "source"
scale_y1 = "1.000000"
shader2 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/d65-d50.slang"
filter_linear2 = "true"
wrap_mode2 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input2 = "false"
alias2 = "WhitePointPass"
float_framebuffer2 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer2 = "false"
scale_type_x2 = "source"
scale_x2 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y2 = "source"
scale_y2 = "1.000000"
shader3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/afterglow.slang"
filter_linear3 = "true"
wrap_mode3 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input3 = "false"
alias3 = "AfterglowPass"
float_framebuffer3 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer3 = "false"
scale_type_x3 = "source"
scale_x3 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y3 = "source"
scale_y3 = "1.000000"
shader4 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/avg-lum.slang"
filter_linear4 = "true"
wrap_mode4 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input4 = "true"
alias4 = "AvgLumPass"
float_framebuffer4 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer4 = "false"
scale_type_x4 = "source"
scale_x4 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y4 = "source"
scale_y4 = "1.000000"
shader5 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize.slang"
filter_linear5 = "true"
wrap_mode5 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input5 = "false"
alias5 = "LinearizePass"
float_framebuffer5 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer5 = "false"
scale_type_x5 = "source"
scale_x5 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y5 = "source"
scale_y5 = "1.000000"
shader6 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_horiz.slang"
filter_linear6 = "true"
wrap_mode6 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input6 = "false"
alias6 = ""
float_framebuffer6 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer6 = "false"
scale_type_x6 = "source"
scale_x6 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y6 = "source"
scale_y6 = "1.000000"
shader7 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/blur_vert.slang"
filter_linear7 = "true"
wrap_mode7 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input7 = "false"
alias7 = "GlowPass"
float_framebuffer7 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer7 = "false"
scale_type_x7 = "source"
scale_x7 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y7 = "source"
scale_y7 = "1.000000"
shader8 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/linearize_scanlines.slang"
filter_linear8 = "true"
wrap_mode8 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input8 = "false"
alias8 = ""
float_framebuffer8 = "true"
srgb_framebuffer8 = "false"
scale_type_x8 = "source"
scale_x8 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y8 = "source"
scale_y8 = "1.000000"
shader9 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/crt-guest-dr-venom.slang"
filter_linear9 = "true"
wrap_mode9 = "clamp_to_border"
mipmap_input9 = "false"
alias9 = ""
float_framebuffer9 = "false"
srgb_framebuffer9 = "false"
scale_type_x9 = "viewport"
scale_x9 = "1.000000"
scale_type_y9 = "viewport"
scale_y9 = "1.000000"
parameters = "TNTC;CP;CS;WP;wp_saturation;SW;AR;PR;AG;PG;AB;PB;sat;lsmooth;GAMMA_INPUT;TAPSH;GLOW_FALLOFF_H;TAPSV;GLOW_FALLOFF_V;TATE;IOS;OS;BLOOM;brightboost;brightboost1;gsl;scanline1;scanline2;beam_min;beam_max;beam_size;h_sharp;s_sharp;csize;bsize;warpX;warpY;glow;shadowMask;masksize;vertmask;slotmask;slotwidth;double_slot;slotms;mcut;maskDark;maskLight;CGWG;gamma_out;spike;inter;interm;bloom;scans"
TNTC = "0.000000"
CP = "0.000000"
CS = "0.000000"
WP = "-15.000000"
wp_saturation = "1.000000"
SW = "1.000000"
AR = "0.070000"
PR = "0.050000"
AG = "0.070000"
PG = "0.050000"
AB = "0.070000"
PB = "0.050000"
sat = "0.100000"
lsmooth = "0.900000"
GAMMA_INPUT = "2.400000"
TAPSH = "4.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_H = "0.300000"
TAPSV = "4.000000"
GLOW_FALLOFF_V = "0.300000"
TATE = "0.000000"
IOS = "0.000000"
OS = "1.000000"
BLOOM = "0.000000"
brightboost = "1.400000"
brightboost1 = "1.150000"
gsl = "0.000000"
scanline1 = "15.000000"
scanline2 = "5.000000"
beam_min = "1.850000"
beam_max = "0.800000"
beam_size = "0.000000"
h_sharp = "5.250000"
s_sharp = "0.400000"
csize = "0.000000"
bsize = "600.000000"
warpX = "0.000000"
warpY = "0.000000"
glow = "0.020000"
shadowMask = "3.000000"
masksize = "1.000000"
vertmask = "0.120000"
slotmask = "0.000000"
slotwidth = "2.000000"
double_slot = "1.000000"
slotms = "1.000000"
mcut = "0.250000"
maskDark = "0.800000"
maskLight = "1.500000"
CGWG = "0.300000"
gamma_out = "2.400000"
spike = "1.000000"
inter = "400.000000"
interm = "1.000000"
bloom = "0.000000"
scans = "0.500000"
textures = "SamplerLUT1;SamplerLUT2;SamplerLUT3"
SamplerLUT1 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron1.png"
SamplerLUT1_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT1_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT1_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT2 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/sony_trinitron2.png"
SamplerLUT2_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT2_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT2_mipmap = "false"
SamplerLUT3 = "shaders_slang/crt/shaders/guest/lut/other1.png"
SamplerLUT3_linear = "true"
SamplerLUT3_wrap_mode = "clamp_to_border"
SamplerLUT3_mipmap = "false"Something to remember with any shots Nesguy does is his monitor backlight is max out. (So try doing that and then viewing his shots, theyāll look considerably better.)
So unless youāre doing the same, his screens are going to seem dark. Just for future reference, lol.
I downloaded @Nesguy raw screenshot and analyzed the values. This is another game with whites in TV levels, but itās curious the whites in the clouds have a value of 251 whilst the traffic sign whites are 243. I observed this also on Tempo for the 32X.
My assumption is that white is 243 and 251 is superwhite, meant to have some glow there for more bloomy clouds. So the shades of the clouds more than seen should hinted at most. My recommendation with grade is to raise brightness a bit since the Sega Luma Fix is for 239 whites. So check how it looks with the Sega Luma Fix enabled, then disable, mimic the look with brightness and lower 1 or 2 points.
Thanks for that disclaimer 
Yep, cranking up the backlight gives a big boost to contrast and the black level shouldnāt be affected as much, expanding the dynamic range and giving you maximum headroom for scanlines and masks. Anything you do to compensate for lost brightness through the shader itself is going to have a detrimental effect on objective picture quality, unfortunately, so increasing the backlight is the best method IMO. @BendBombBoom give my suggestions a try with the backlight maxed out and see what you think. As far as the image being too cool, I think thereās some stuff in grade you can alter that isnāt accessible via the parameter options (need to open the file in a text editor and edit the shader).
@Dogway nice observations! Iām not sure I understand your suggestions, though. Raising brightness or using Sega Luma Fix just removes all detail in the clouds.
I think my most recent shot is showing all the detail in the clouds, so Iām happy with it as far as the dynamic range is concerned. I should probably remove the red push, actually, as it makes things oversaturated in most games with the expanded dynamic range. Looks okay here, I suppose.
TBH I think this might be the best one. No red push, scanline dark/bright 1.30/0.70.
Based on my tests using these settings with other games, Iām not totally convinced that these clouds are supposed to be pure white. We should only use the reference shot to judge dynamic range IMO. I found that the red push causes over-saturation in almost every game I tested so I wound up removing it.
Maybe try red push and lowering the hue vs sat red down some?
Iāll give that a shot, thanks for the suggestion.
Np, it may cause some weirdness though, as itās messing with the entire red hue channel, š¤·. But itās worth a shot, lol.
Because Iāve messed up terms before, ābacklightā is also brightness of screen correct? Iām doing most of this on laptop that goes to about 400 nits. Again this might all be do to different monitors but the here is Alien Trilogy on the Sega Saturn at the end of the first hallway on the first level. First is no shaders, Nesguyās shader and than mine. Itās nothing drastic but it definitely makes this super dark game even darker.
Than again you can see the hand in Nesguyās preset has better saturation than mine.
@BendBombBoom No, backlight and Brightness are two separate things!
Glad you asked though, lol.
Not sure if you can adjust the backlight on laptop, thatās more of a TV/monitor thing. (Iām not sure how brightness on a laptop works tbh, this may be the same thing in the situation.)
If raising it starts to wash out colors, then itās not what the ābacklightā thing Iām mentioning. If colors are still the same just your screen looks like you turned a light on brighter then itās the right thing.
Try enabling Sega Luma fix and post a screenshot, please. Also try gamma 2.60. Thereās no one-size-fits-all for shader settings, unfortunately. You may have to raise dark pixel bright boost. Iāll DL Alien Trilogy and see what I can come up with.
I give up on trying to remove the blue bias, I think thatās deliberate. As far as Iām concerned, all the detail in Outrun is visible, and thatās primarily what Iām concerned with, here. The blue bias is a separate issue.
Is there a specific reason youāre asking him to turn on the Sega luma fix?
Thought it might affect the whole range but itās just the high end. So nevermind. I think it should be enabled anyway for Saturn, but it wonāt help with the darkness in this situation.
Yeah, Saturn is under the recommendations for the Sega luma fix, Iām pretty sure. I think the only Sega system itās not recommended for is the Dreamcast.
Also the whites in Booms preset are leaning towards the green right? Or is it some nonsense Iām just seeing, look at the 099 in the upper right corner.
Iām not sure the backlight will help with games with primarily dark pallettes in this situation anyway. Most likely the scanlines, contrast, or black-level will have to be adjusted. (But the contrast/black level will open a whole new can of worms.)
Yes, they are. Bottom left 030 shows this better. I think this might be the deconvergence.
I have a nice LG oled tv Iāll also try these shaders on and see what get. There is no perfect shader but I still try. Contrasting your settings with mine has helped me improve things like the dynamic range. I enjoy the pain of this struggle.
