RetroArch/Core → Scaling!

RetroArch Additions Shaders
#1

Hello,

Duck needs to know…

If you have a 16/9 Widescreen TV/Monitor, and the AR scaling settings in Both RA and Teletubby screen are set to 16/9. shouldn’t the scan lines produced by the shader be perfectly aligned ?

Easy logical answer would be yes, but it isn’t !!
It doesn’t seem to matter what I let determine the aspect ratio, by ra or the core…

The coyote ugly bad results are alway’s the same on my HDTV…

Unless i change the AR from my teletubby to the → ONE and → ONLY AR setting that seems to work !? Namely, “Scan Mode” …!!

It’s puzzling that even though everything is set to 16/9 (TV included), scanlines just isn’t evenly spread !!!

Imagine , not having an TV set that can AI Scan the AR !!! The One and Only option that seems to work !!

Maybe, RA bug ?

cheers, TD

#2

I’m no expert but I guess TVs do some level of process of the signal, sometime this “extra” processing can be disable sometimes not. Look in your tv options. Also try aspect ratio → Full. If I have to guess your problem is “in” the tv and not in retroarch.

#3

That’s the first thing i did. But no matter , Full, 16:9 (wich is also fullscreen on a widescreen monitor). When my FHD3DLGdreamTV :kissing_closed_eyes: is not set to AR → Scan Input. I get erratic scanlines all over my screen !!

No, i like to think my teletubby is still healthy :kissing_smiling_eyes: .

But here’s the thing and why i suspect an RA/Core bug, eventhough my tv can correct it , still i have to be caution…

Because when i set BeetleHW → CropOverscan to Dynamic or none, WamBam Thank you m’am (not so -_-) yep you’ve guessed it…

Scanline → misalignement ALL over again… Now, in this ↑ case → none of my TV AR settings will solve that !!

The scanlines are only evenly spaced when all SETTINGS Core+RA+TV are a match made for heaven :innocent: :ok_hand:

Edit: forgot to mention … perfect match = Core+RA+TV**&**only a few → Shader TWEAKS regarding the scaling/scanline issue i’ve had :hot_face:

Cheers, TD

1 Like
#4

I truly hesitate to say anything because you have demonstrated your derision towards opposing opinions… but what the hell.

I’m not sure you should expect perfect alignment using full screen, only using “Core Provided” aspect ratio. Why would emulated hardware that was intended to be displayed in a 320x224 display ratio (For example) look correct at 3840x2160?

There are many, many people that are not having issues, why on earth do you think that in your brief time here you have magically discovered so many elusive bugs?

Don’t bother commenting sir because I really don’t care. :neutral_face:

#5

I assume when you say “scanlines” you mean the empty scanlines (black bars) in some CRT emulation shaders. These are a resolution thing, not an aspect ratio thing. If your input is 640x480, and your television is 640x480, you should have a 1:1 picture. If the picture you’re getting is showing empty scanlines higher than 1 pixel, some upscaling is being used.

#6

Yes, mostly the dark spots / lines stand out in pairs of 3-4 lines !

Yes resolution ↑ plays an role too …
To be precise, it’s matter of chosing the “internal resolution” upscaled/native too !!

More over, i have noticed that the Internal res is a more determining factor in ppsspp in terms of scan lines than in BeetleHW when using shaders !!!

But believe when i tell you , that as far as psxHW concerns… AR plays an BIGGER role regarding the scanlines … No matter what resolution i configurate i.e: native x2, x4, x8… RA Output resolution (1080p = TV FHD native res, 1440p = Monitor) etc etc… doesn’t matter … AR superseeds that all !!

in ppsspp i had the same issue, and just changing the internal resolution in there helped me unlike psxHW → AR → CroppedOverscan = static is needed … to name one setting !!

Cheers, TD

#7

I’m sorry, but I have a hard time understanding you. :thinking:

Yes, mostly the dark spots / lines stand out in pairs of 3-4 lines !

This clearly means your picture is upscaled. Internal resolution has nothing to do with it, it all boils down to the output resolution of your monitor. If your television is not set to the exact resolution of your input, you cannot except an exact match.

The PSP has a resolution of 480x272, I strongly doubt you have a television of that resolution, right? If you set up RetroArch to output 1080p, to accomodate a 1080 monitor, it will upscale it to match this resolution. So, if you want a perfect match you need to set RetroArch’s screen resolution to 480x272 and you need a monitor that has this exact resolution. But you won’t find any.

Standard CRTs had a 640x480 output. Which is why a 240p console like the NES would show empty scanlines (1 scanline for the game output and 1 empty line, alternating) otherwise the game would only fill half the screen. So if you have a CRT like that, you don’t even need a shader, but the empty scanlines wouldn’t be spread evenly because 272p isn’t equal to 480 / 2. I’m not sure how it would behave actually, probably a black bar somewhere.

But modern monitors don’t work like that. If the input is 272p and the monitor is native 1080p, the input will just be upscaled, there will be no gap.

#8

Google translate is mens “best friend” :thinking:

Appearantly it does in ppsspp :flushed: …

Again, i had the same issue in ppsspp using that → shader… And as soon i changed the internal resolution , wich is pretty much all you can do appart from the other upscaling settings in ppsspp …

I got back an CRT look alike nice polished game :slightly_smiling_face:

I can post some before/after screenshots , but why would i make this stuff up :roll_eyes:

so, if this duck reads you correct…

The only correct sollution is to find an TUBE teletubby … right?

But then i wouldn’t need to use of any shaders to simulate scanlines…

cheers, TD

#9

Incorrect. The solution is to use “Core Provided” Video scaling in Retroarch and enable “Integer Scale”.

This will provide a video output that exactly matches the original hardware.

To use your words… you need to “squish your game to the size of a mushroom”. There is no bug in Retroarch and nothing is wrong with the shader.

What is broken is both your intent and your attempted solutions. You simply need to stop trying to display your content at the TVs native resolution and revert to the native resolution of the emulated hardware.

1 Like
#10

You my benevolent onion are incorrect… If that wos the case, i would’nt have created an thread about it ! Because dizzz duck have tried ALLLL,
i.e: Integer, non-integer… integer + “integer” → overscan integer…integer integer … input johny 5 … :smile:

I mean , Are you questioning diz ducks “integer” integrity :fist::laughing:?

Your reply amuses diz duck :rofl:

Because… You didn’t put the following STOP :smile: :raised_hand_with_fingers_splayed: line your last reply to duck :smile: :rofl: :joy: ↓

… :neutral_face:… :point_left: :laughing:

Away put your weapo… duck means you NO harm :hatched_chick:

#11

Most likely your TV’s 16:9 setting does not show the full picture and scales slightly to remove broadcast signal overscan.

Indeed ’ Just Scan’ and similarly named TV settings display the full image as intended.

#12

Well, hello KIT (Knight Industries Two Thousand) :sunglasses: :ok_hand:

It’s interesting you mentioned that part about the TV not showing full picture … :slightly_smiling_face:
Do you happend to own an LG 3DHDdreamTV :thinking: ?

It’s very true, that model i have, has the tendency to cut of very small parts (up / down … not side ways) of the video/image when choosing AR 16:9 (wich is standard widescreens AR nowday’s though), or even cut of pieces set at → Original aspect. Hence, i have to keep it set to “Scan” Mode , wich litteraly means it scans AR from the source aswell … I.E: when source is 4:3 , it will display it as such with black borders at both sides ofcourse…

That’s why i have to set the AR in RA :wink: to either 16:9 or Full for fullscreen image (no borders).

Anyway, dominion back there mentioned it’s as easy as setting everything to native/default… I WISH it wos that easy …

Because, in window mode everthing shows perfectly aligned on my HDTV, but going to fullscreen it looks garbled !!

Even on my computer monitor wich is an widescreen aswell, the scanlines can look missaligned, if i change the Cropped settings to Dynamic or None in BeetleHW !!! Just by changing that one setting can break my 7 layered shader stack on both my screens …

So, i don’t think it’s solely an hardware / firmware issue !!!

cheers, TD

#13

Duck, is this only a Beetle PSX thing? What about other cores?

Try SNES with the 240p suite, aspect ratio core provided, integer scale on.

#14

No, psxArmed is an complete disaster!! You have NONE-ZERO settings to play with in psxArmed… And ofcourse, the scanline issue resurfaces in there too → AND on my main screen desktop monitor noless ! :face_with_raised_eyebrow: …

So far as for the TV being at fault here !

That’s why mentioned several times that one and important setting in Beetle HW that needs to be changed aswell to “finally” make it all work together RA+EMU+TV …

A. RA → scaling to either Full or 16:9 (for fullscreen / lil or no black borders top/bottom)

B: Beetle → Overcrop must be Static not Dynamic or None

C. Adjust the right AR setting in my TV setup

D. Shader scaling adjustments…

Everything needs to be customized, else i get to see those eratic black horizontal lines ALL the TIME.

Then in psp, i had the same problem … But in there i had to adjust Internal resolution… to get the good scanline results… !! Wich is 1440p :sweat_smile: …

Fortunately i have an decent GPU to handle all that at 100% emu speed LoL!!

Since the Shader acts up in pretty much all Emulators, iam not 100% but 1000% certain that the syntax / parameters in that shader isn’t right for FULLSCREEN atleast…

It doesn’t matter so much wich settings are used when lets say you run an emu in windowed mode (even if native res is set at 4x = upscaled !!) . Only in window mode the scanlines looks perfect aligned…

But in window mode, the psx boot screens looks very dark… but once it goes to Title menu ingame colors are bright and clean again …

I dunno, but my current settings everything runs just perfect in FULLSCREEN, i never play in window mode anyways…

cheers, TD

#15

I will test it… but , don’t hold your breath on it…

cheers, TD

#16

Well duck it seems your setup is off somewhere in some strange way… I have no problems with scanline distortion on any of my devices and screens when using the appropriate settings… it is almost certainly not a bug in RA.

#17

What do you hear, What do you say :smile:

Let’s have some Duck qaulity time now, shall we… :hatching_chick:

In all fairness now, it’s as i suspected !! “Core→Cropped” settings in emulators are doing something special in a good way to rectify it !!

I just did an quick run in Snes (Bsnes) current version…

And i will say this, the snes project sure must have been an priority sometime in the past :sweat_smile: Tons of snes emu’s to choose from :dizzy_face:,

So, i did an quick run… And EXACTLY the same thing happend , and yes i had to change the SAME thing in the emulator → “Cropped settings” a.k.a pixel offset to 0 in snes to have perfect fullscreen scanlines on both monitors !!! I know, you have the scale parameters in the shader too you can encrease or decrease… But since i use the shader global for every emulator, i don’t want to tweak the shader everytime i run another emulator,… So that’s why i look for an way to make it permanent in the core/emu…

And fortunately, as long the emulator has some scaling/cropping features to play with , the scanlines will follow…

But again, like i said before … in window mode it looks awfull now, so it has definitely something to do with the scaling factor too !!

But i have to keep the AR settings to “just Scan” on my hdtv…

Generaly it works, as long i have some options in the emu to get it to work flawless in fullscreen !!

cheers, TD

#18

Perhaps… But you haven’t tried out my custom build shader preset yet :sweat_smile:

In the screenshot ↓ wich shader i exactly use, the settings and in what → order (important) … [

And please try the shader at emu’s default settings…

You’ll probebly might think, why use additional scaling shaders… Well, just using 4xBR-hybrid-crt didn’t play nice, on any setting i could think of… and believe me, i tried every combination i could think of !!..

So, i had to add scalefx hybrid shader to get it to work properly in conjuction with the 4xBR shader at the bottom place !!

If it works for you, i eat my shoelaces… Not that iam THAT hungry though … :sweat_smile:

cheers Td,

#19

Upload a GPU screenshot (with the shader) and a non-GPU screenshot of the same image so we can have a look.

Edit: preferably with the grid image from 240pSuite on SNES.

#20

You lost me there? What would be the point of doing that ? Both screenshots will look the same !?!

And are you asking an screenshot from the emu running in windowed or fullscreen mode ?

Edit: Also, 240pSuite … Who or What is that :sweat_smile: … Is that some custom made snes rom to test scanlines ? If so, do i use it with shaders enabled / emu + RA at default settings …?

Also, i have tested my suspicions on other core emulators. And the One setting that keeps biting my butt, is called “Cropped Overscan” … !!! BeetleHW has it, Bsnes has that setting, and every time i need to change that one “insignifant” setting in order for me to get the scanlines evenly spaced in fullscreen !!!

Just fyi… There ↑ lies the problem (atleast partialy) iam sure of…

Cheers, TD