I have a feeling that this is identical to the one I used which is the one just before the 1080p support was added.
I also used the corresponding parameters.h file because that also changed.
I also recreated the crt-sony-megatron-source.slang file but that was probably unnecessary.
Ah you mention Mega Bezel - are you using vanilla Sony Megatron or Sony Megatron through the Mega Bezel framework?
Sorry to hear that - the state of HDR on Windows as well as not being able to turn on/off RA features from shaders means its not quite plug and play yet.
It should just have been to turn off HDR in RA and to use the SDR presets btw.
It’s the only one that supports HDR.
I tried the new version using the Sony PVM 2730 HDR Preset and I was able to reproduce my “correct” looking results from 10 days ago.
Basically I had to use that preset and reproduce my settings for RetroArch HDR and Megatron SDR for it to look the same. I’m sure it might look similar with RetroArch SDR and Megatron SDR. When both RetroArch and Megatron HDR are on with that preset it doesn’t look as bad as the Sony PVM 1910 in HDR mode using the new OLED Layout but you still can see the additional red subpixels in the background.
I’ll follow up with the pics when I get a chance.
Thanks for the support. I guess in order to have the perfect OLED preset some further calibration might be needed or what we have right now might just be the closest that we can get.
So far this has all been about the “phosphors” and subpixel level stuff. The overall full screen image and colours are a whole different topic.
Let me post a quick pic just as proof of what I’m saying:
Sony Megatron Sony PVM 2730 HDR Preset
4K, 300TVL, RWBG OLED Layout
RetroArch - HDR On, Shader Preset set to SDR
Will follow up with more later…
Sony Megatron Sony PVM 2730 HDR Preset
4K, 300TVL, RWBG OLED Layout
RetroArch - HDR On, Shader Preset set to HDR
My apologies for the inconsistent stabilization of the photos.
Right ok so just tested latest version with 300TVL RWBG (OLED) sub pixel layout at 4K and I get this which looks correct given its on an RGB LCD screen.
Just writing out the RRBBGGX mask it would look like this on an RGB LCD screen:
RxxRxxxxBxxBxGxxGxxxx
Which matches up with the above image - I’d say.
So it’s not the shader then - which is progress! Something to do with HDR then - kind of feels like some TV image processing is kicking in when HDR is on or something?
Just to say setting RA to have HDR on and setting the shader to have SDR on is going to give bad results as in the colours will be all washed out. But to be fair that shouldn’t change the mask and sub pixels as you say. Just the overall image is going to look terrible.
And another photo of the 1910 PVM preset with RWBG (OLED) layout selected. Again it looks correct given its on an RGB LCD.
200 ISO:
100 ISO:
No, it doesn’t seem so. It definitely is progress!
Yes, I agree, when certain (possibly brightness and/or saturation) thresholds are crossed, a lot of strange things start happening with the subpixels.
That explains why the anomalies appear different when a different preset is used with both having the same layout and TVL settings and also why it seems that the problem is diminished when switching down from HDR to SDR in the Shader and possibly even more so by further switching down to SDR in RetroArch as well.
At least it’s not as bad as when using a non RRGGBBX layout though with the width of the triads and spacing being completely inconsistent in addition to the overlapping we are still witnessing above when in HDR Mode.
I know this is not the proper way to set things up but I was experimenting with all possible combinations of settings trying to see which ones look the best objectively and this is how I accidentally stumbled upon the image that looked “corrrect” using this shader.
From memory, I think RetroArch HDR On + Megatron HDR Off looked more saturated than with HDR On in this particular preset on my screen. With Megatron HDR Off it looked a bit less rich in the colours. It is easy for me to double check this.
This is unlike the completely “off” look that the Sony PVM 1910 HDR preset would show when HDR in RetroArch and the Shader are mismatched.
In SDR Mode, (Both in RetroArch and in the Shader), the Sony PVM 2730 HDR Preset looks similar to HDR On in RetroArch, HDR Off in the Shader, but considerably darker.
So I think the next step is for interested parties to start with their favourite Sony Megatron Color Video Monitor HDR preset and tweak it until they get their subpixels and their colours to look right.
I’m sure there are other dedicated OLED TV users out there who are willing to spend the time to tweak, fine tune and share there results with the wider community.
Am I right?
This might give rise to a subset of “Optimized for OLED TV” Presets that can possibly be added to the shader once they’re good enough.
Thanks for laying the groundwork @MajorPainTheCactus. You’ve accomplished quite a bit here.
One thing, I would add is that to get the Slot Mask to look right on OLED TV it needs to also have a specific structure that fits.
I think I’ll move on to that next to see if this is the case already with the new shader.
So basically we’ve finally matched the CRT-Guest-Advanced Aperture Grill, Mask 12, “BGR” Layout reference image with Sony Megatron Color Video Monitor 4K, 300TVL, RWBG OLED Layout.
Now let’s see if the same can be done for the CRT-Guest-Advanced Slot Mask Preset and reference image!
I think this is only the case when you’re talking about the full mask on the entire screen at all times.
For example, if you could tune it so a given triad only starts to “bleed” out of the mask once it gets to a certain brightness level, it could still look sharp on a majority of the screen while also having a bit of a brightness boost.
And I don’t know exactly how it works but maybe you could do something where the phosphors switch from solid RGB into CMY and whatever other combination after a certain point to utilize more sub-pixels. Like imagine a phosphor control with adjustable threshold, knee, and ratio (using audio compressor terms) depending on the bright : accurate balance someone wants. I suppose you could also choose to do it for the whole triad or individual phosphors depending on what ends up looking better.
So the user could choose between more accurate phosphors bleeding out of the mask, a strict mask with less accurate phosphor color, or a combination.
I understand this goes beyond the scope of your original idea, but I don’t think I’m the only one that would greatly appreciate that extra level of control. At least until we’re all using 10,000 nit displays with a highly tunable rolling refresh to really get close to the actual CRT look in motion and not just in pictures.
These additions would make it usable on way more displays and probably make it a lot easier to get a good look on these odd sub-pixel layouts like WOLED and the triangular QD-OLED, both of which are going to be seeing a lot more use over the next couple of years with more monitors utilizing those panel types on manufacturer roadmaps.
If you really feel uncomfortable about compromising this project, maybe spin it off as “Phony Megatron” or something?
Yes so the only correct options are to either have full SDR (RA + Megatron) or have full HDR (RA + Megatron) any other combination is wrong and no matter how much fiddling a user does they’re not going to get correct results.
If you’ve got HDR on in both RA and Megatron and it’s giving strange results as you and @Wilch have now shown then really the only hope is to get the TV to stop doing that extra post processing if possible as you’re not going to be able to predict that post processing from a shader and then apply the appropriate inverse transform before sending it to the TV.
If you can’t turn the post processing off then SDR is really your only option. Sure you can use HDR if you wish but it’s a case of living with whatever artefacts you think are least worst but it won’t be correct.
As @Nesguy pointed out above, we can already do the hybrid approach with CRT-Guest-Advanced.
I’m happy for the addition of an RWBG OLED Mask, now it’s just to load up and fine tune those presets and enjoy some games!
My vote is for Sony Megatron Color Video Monitor to remain on this path of maintaining accuracy.
Hi DevonCM hope you’re well. So where I see this shader fitting in the ‘market’ so to speak is for it to give the best experience out of the box for 400-600+ nit range TVs (not exactly sure what the cut off point is).
That’s currently a huge range of displays because it includes a lot of laptop displays and is only growing.
I think Guest Advanced does an excellent job of covering the below 400 nit TV range and I’m not going to really be able to add value there - sure I might do it a bit different here and there but itd probably be a bit worse in certain things and a bit better in other things and I kind of don’t really see the need - it’s a great shader.
I kind of see this shader as dropping the baggage of all the blurs, blooms etc to focus on accuracy and performance (if we ever get to the point where high refresh rates are required) and keeping things simple (if that’s such a thing for a shader trying to emulate a huge range of CRTs).
Just a quick point on QD-OLED I think this shader will work perfectly fine on them with a very small tweak to the vertical deconvergence on the green channel to make up for the offset in this channel.
I’m not sure what the current state of Megatron on OLED is, but the recent few shots all have something amiss - either the green is too close to the red or the blue is too close to the green (which is as expected).
There were just some commits made to hopefully fix some issues with HDR via Vulkan, if anyone wants to give that a(nother) shot. The changes should make it into the latest nightly builds in a few hours.
man i cannot be thankful enough your hard work is greatly appreciated you saved me a ton of money and searching i wish i can help you in anyway like you did
Fantastic to hear, you’re more than welcome. Please share any photos or details of your display it’s greatly appreciated.
Hopefully it’s all ironed out in latest with thanks to @Cyber for persevering with me. There does seem to be a big issue with OLEDs and HDR though - some post processing kicks in, I believe, as both Cyber and @Wilch seem to have the same problem.
I just tried this shader (2730QM SDR preset) on a Philips 276e8v 27" 4K IPS with peak nits of 350 (SDR) in a dark room and although not the brightest it was definitely acceptable IMO.
Sorry for the delay. Honestly, I can’t see the artifact with the naked eye. The iphone does a lot of real time processing too. I also didn’t test the TVs sharpness setting while taking a macro shot, I only used my eyes, but couldnt detect anything, but I believe 10 is the default for LG OLEDs and any lower actually blurs it slightly. I’ll take some new photos using a third party app without processing later
Nice shots. What preset is this and what adjustments have you made if any?
